Episode 342 || Pandemic Reading
In this week’s episode, Annie and her friend Hunter are talking about “pandemic brain” and how their literary tastes have changed since March of 2020.
To purchase the books mentioned in this episode, visit our new website:
Matrix by Lauren Groff
Real Life by Brandon Taylor
Leave the World Behind by Rumaan Alam
Most Likely by Sarah Watson
Millennial Nuns by the Daughters of St. Paul
Baby-Sitters Club by Ann M. Martin
Anna Karenina by Leo Tolstoy (currently unavailable)
Middlemarch by George Eliot (currently unavailable)
My Life in Middlemarch by Rebecca Mead
Milk Blood Heat by Dantiel W. Moniz
The Death of Vivek Oji by Akwaeke Emezi
A Burning by Megha Majumdar
Transcendent Kingdom by Yaa Gyasi
Luster by Raven Leilani
From the Front Porch is a weekly podcast production of The Bookshelf, an independent bookstore in South Georgia. You can follow The Bookshelf’s daily happenings on Instagram at @bookshelftville, and all the books from today’s episode can be purchased online through our store website, www.bookshelfthomasville.com.
A full transcript of today’s episode can be found below.
Special thanks to Dylan and his team at Studio D Podcast Production for sound and editing and for our theme music, which sets the perfect warm and friendly tone for our Thursday conversations.
Thank you again to this week’s sponsor, Visit Thomasville. Whether you live close by or are passing through, I hope you'll visit beautiful Thomasville, Georgia: www.thomasvillega.com.
This week, Annie is reading Groundskeeping by Lee Cole. Hunter is reading The Souvenir Museum by Elizabeth McCracken.
If you liked what you heard on today’s episode, tell us by leaving a review on iTunes. Or, if you’re so inclined, support us on Patreon, where you can hear our staff’s weekly New Release Tuesday conversations, read full book reviews in our monthly Shelf Life newsletter, follow along as Hunter and I conquer a classic, and receive free media mail shipping on all your online book orders. Just go to patreon.com/fromthefrontporch.
We’re so grateful for you, and we look forward to meeting back here next week.
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episode transcript:
Annie Jones [00:00:02] Welcome to From the Front Porch, a conversational podcast about books, small business, and life in the South. [music plays out]
[as music fades out]
“‘I think you should learn, of course, and some days you must learn a great deal. But you should also have days when you allow what is already in you to swell up inside of you until it touches everything.’”
― E.L. Konigsburg, From the Mixed-Up Files of Mrs. Basil E. Frankwiler
I’m Annie Jones, owner of The Bookshelf, an independent bookstore in beautiful downtown Thomasville, Georgia, and this week, I’m joined by my friend and #bookstagram celebrity, Hunter Mclendon. Hunter and I are both avid readers, but our reading lives have definitely been affected by these pandemic days. Today we’re talking about “pandemic brain” and how our literary tastes have changed since March of 2020.
Before we get started, this is your friendly reminder that From the Front Porch is a production of The Bookshelf, an indie bookstore in Thomasville, Georgia. As our store heads into the last three months of the year, we hope you’ll consider shopping small. Our online store is always open, and we’d be so happy to mail holiday gifts your way. Because of supply chain issues and potential shipping snafus, I -- like everyone else -- am encouraging you to shop now. This month, we’ve got three virtual events designed specifically for our long-distance customers to help you find book titles for every reader on your shopping list -- just visit bookshelfthomasville.com to snag your tickets. At the risk of beating a metaphorical dead horse, October is the new December. We hope you’ll support our small business when you shop this holiday season.
Now -- onto the show.
Annie Jones [00:02:00] Hi, Hunter.
Hunter McLendon [00:02:01] Hello.
Annie Jones [00:02:03] Welcome back.
Hunter McLendon [00:02:04] Thank you for having me here.
Annie Jones [00:02:07] OK. You and I texted about this topic. I don't even remember. We've texted a lot during the pandemic. We saw each other in person, which was beautiful and glorious. But we were texting about this topic because I feel like I keep texting you, 'Am I OK?' To not be reading what I normally reading? Why did my old literary shoes no longer fit? Is what it feels like, and you feel similarly, I think.
Hunter McLendon [00:02:37] Yeah, like first of all, there was about, I think, the first six months of this year. It was very difficult for me to read any book I was picking up. Like, I mean, and I and I knew there were even books I was rereading that I have reread many times and been just as in love with each time I read them and I was like, Why am I not even able to connect with these books that I have loved for years?
Annie Jones [00:03:01] Yeah. So even rereading wasn't was wasn't working for, you?
Hunter McLendon [00:03:06] No, and and I. And it's so funny too, because I was I think about how a lot of my favorite authors had books come out this year, too, that I was like, Oh, surely I will. And I even I think I talk to you about like Lauren Groth or her new book Matrix just came out, which I do love. But the first time I read it, I was like, It's I'm not connecting. And it was because the pandemic brain.
Annie Jones [00:03:30] Yes, you had a hard time with that. At first, I remember. And I so I want to talk about pandemic brain because you and I are talking about this. I feel like there are think pieces about it. There's Adam Grant's think piece about languishing. And I think all of that like burnout, fatigue, exhaustion, all of that certainly plays into what I am calling pandemic brain. What you were calling pandemic brain. What are the symptoms to you of pandemic brain? I have the ones, I think, but I'd love to hear what you think when you say pandemic brain, what do you mean?
Hunter McLendon [00:04:02] I think that like for me, it's just being like, honestly, it feels like being malnourished while also having like four energy drinks at once and knowing that, you know, another planet is like heading towards our very destination.
Annie Jones [00:04:22] Which kind of eliminates like it kind of makes you feel like, why bother? Yeah, yeah. Like, what's the point? I think for me, when I mean pandemic brain, I think I mean a change in attention span.
Hunter McLendon [00:04:35] Mm hmm.
Annie Jones [00:04:36] A change in capacity for intake, like it's not just attention span because I still now boy, have I watched a lot of Friends episodes like so I'm definitely even even TV and movies aren't hitting quite the same, but I can. It's like I can intake certain things like a 30 minute episode of TV or an hour and a half long movie, but my capacity is limited. And then what I can handle is different. And I think a lot of people have talked about feel good literature, but that's really not even it for me, although I definitely appreciate, feel good literature. There was a time, though, where feel-good literature almost also felt like too light, like, like, like, we're going through a pandemic and I'm reading about things that it feels like I'll never get to experience again.
Hunter McLendon [00:05:28] It's yeah, it's one of those things to me where I feel like, honestly, I think a lot about this past year. I thought about how when I was like 15, 16, 17, I was going through a lot of hard things and it was really hard for me to read about, like people who were just like, you know, dancing through fields of daisies is because I was like, OK, well, great, like I'm able to do that soup, you know, because you had to do get bitter about it, but you also don't read anything that's super triggering because you're like, Well, I want to just cry now.
Annie Jones [00:05:57] Yeah, yeah. I thought briefly, this is an idea that I think I've gone ahead and nixed. But I thought very briefly about for the summer of 2022, doing a nostalgia young adult book club, which we've done with Babysitters Club. We've done with some 80s 90s y-lit this year, but I was like, Oh, we could just do it for the summer and we could call it summertime sadness. And I only read teen angst books, and it was like any no, no summertime sadness that sounds so depressing.
Hunter McLendon [00:06:31] Also, I don't know if you can handle it, like maybe I'm just thinking about like my personal teen angst books I read, but...
Annie Jones [00:06:38] Some of them are dark. Like if you just Google teen angst books because I was like, What would come to mind? And then it was like the Virgin Suicides, and I was like, Well, I don't know.
Hunter McLendon [00:06:49] Well, there's literally an author, Ellen Hopkins, who writes like Z Teen Angst Books, you know, like. And one of them, one of my favorite ones and I was 16, was called Tricks. And it's literally about like teen sex workers. I'm like, Who? Do not let you. I mean, I don't know. Like, you know what? Like, I guess I thought it was great when I was 16, but I'm also like, who? Let me read that?
Annie Jones [00:07:09] Yeah. Yes. So I'm reevaluating the summertime sadness idea. Put it on hold. I put it on the shelf. But I I just feel like pre-pandemic, you and I read a pretty, our Venn diagrams had a pretty wide overlap, lots of literary fiction, literary nonfiction. And it's like, that's the first. That's the first sense I lost. Or that's the first bit of taste I lost in terms of pandemic brain. Literary fiction became this thing that I felt like I could no longer. I felt so ambivalent about it and felt like I couldn't finish a book. Couldn't, couldn't get into a book. I loved how you word it like I couldn't connect with the material. And that was so disheartening to me, because literary fiction is typically what I say. My favorite genre is like, I don't even really think about it. It's just the natural answer that kind of rolls off my tongue. And now I'm like, What do I like to read? I don't even know.
Hunter McLendon [00:08:14] Yeah, I it's, you know, it's so funny because I I think you and I have talked a lot about how this year it's like, wow, it's like it's literary fiction, just like not nearly as good as it's been. But I'm also wondering, like it? Or is it just like, I don't know, hypercritical and hyper aware of everything because of where we're at?
Annie Jones [00:08:33] Yeah. OK, so how is your reading life currently like you had your highs and your lows in 2020? Early 2021, where are you now?
Hunter McLendon [00:08:45] So, the National Book Award longlist and now shortlist for fiction was just released this week and I that's just something I love every year is reading those. I'm still like, I'm not reading at nearly the pace I used to read at, like, especially lately, I feel like I've only been reading a book a week, which feels like nothing to me.
Annie Jones [00:09:07] Yes, you even your numbers like, not that it's, you know, it's not important, but you typically read so much more than I do quantity wise. And I I don't even remember what your last review was, but I was like, Oh my gosh, I've read more than Hunter this year, which is unheard of.
Hunter McLendon [00:09:24] Like, honestly, it's so funny because I notice I was like, I noticed that you had read more than me, and I was like, Oh my gosh, who am I? Like, what is going on? I'm glad that you noticed that too, because I literally thought the same thing.
Annie Jones [00:09:35] Yeah, yeah. So you're not reading maybe at the same pace. Do you feel like you're getting your reading like you're reading legs back?
Hunter McLendon [00:09:44] I do, because I I've been pushing myself. I've been pushing because at one point I just kind of like, what like and I do this a lot. But working when a book wasn't jiving with me, like I knew it was good and I knew that I would have liked it. Another time I kept pushing. But then I'd get to like, I literally get to 80 percent done and then give up before I finish the last 40 percent because I was like, I like what I feel like. It's like a sign of depression, but you know? But then I started pushing myself to finish like the last 20 percent, and that kind of helped me. And also, I feel like I've just read some really great books in the past couple weeks that kind of have helped.
Annie Jones [00:10:20] I think that's what has helped me. I think you and I are almost two different frames of thought. Although I've been at different places in different points of the pandemic, I think currently I am feeling a little bit better about things because I've read when I finish, you mentioned Matrix when I finish Matrix, which I think because I knew you had struggled a little bit with it just to get it, just to connect with it at first and. Because I knew it was a departure from Fates and Furies, which I loved. I I don't know if it's that I have low expectations or just that I thought, I think I honestly thought, I'm not going to be able to finish this. I'm going to start this. I'm going to read a few pages enough to talk about it, but I'm not going to be able to finish. And then I wound up falling in love with it and devouring it. And that was so surprising to me that I like it gave me this reader's high that I hadn't had in a long time. And so since then, I read books like Bewilderment or The New Richard Powers, which I loved, or we finished Middlemarch, and then we read My Life in Middlemarch. Like, I think I finished some of these books that I thought I wasn't going to like or wasn't going to be able to finish. And that kind of gave me the incentive I needed, I guess, to keep going. So I currently feel much better than I did maybe four weeks ago or six weeks ago. But I also think it's funny your solution has been to power through. I think mine has been just forget it. Like, you know how we frequently talk in reader world about like, how do you get over a reading rut? And before I used to say, Oh, I read a young adult book or I read a rom com, or I read a thriller like anything kind of genre specific that I can fly through. And now I think I'm kind of like, Don't read if you're in a reading rut, don't read, get your content somewhere else, which sounds bonkers to me. Like, that's not the typical advice I would give at all. But I think sometimes we just don't want to do something, and it's OK to feel fatigued by something. And chances are, if you are a lifelong reader, the love will come back like it will come back. And so that's another thing that I guess I've kind of realized is don't panic and don't try to force something. Maybe, just maybe just say, OK, I'm not going to. I'm not going to worry about this. I'm going to watch a movie or I'm going to spend time with Jordan. And a book will strike. Like for the first time this week, I've been like, Oh, what am I going to read next year, which I have not had that feeling in months? I think partly, I mean, my life like yours is kind of dictated by book world like I need to be reading for Shelf subscriptions or I need to be reading for work or for literary lunch or whatever all things I really like. But this week, for the first time, I was kind of like, Ooh, what am I going to pick up? Like it was, it felt more serendipitous than it had been in a while. So I think that is maybe, maybe the pendulum is starting to pick pick up steam. I don't know.
Hunter McLendon [00:13:21] No. Yeah, well, I was just about to say, I think that it is a tricky. Like, I think that a lot of people have been affected by the pandemic, what they're reading. But I also think that, um, I was wondering, you know, like if if this has made you reevaluate your relationship to reading because, you know, because I mean, because because I think that it's reading has become tricky for you, whether it really kind of being a huge part of your job.
Annie Jones [00:13:46] Yes, I think pre-pandemic, whatever people were like, Oh, do you still love to read? I would have been like, Yes, I love to read like, it is absolutely my favorite hobby. It is when I feel most myself post or during. We're not really post pandemic. Let's be real. This phase of the pandemic, I definitely feel like. And maybe this is even if not healthier, more realistic. I think I am realizing, oh, reading is part of my job. And there are some things I have to read for work. I hope Shelf subscriptions and discovering a Shelf subscription always feels. Exciting and like a gift, but there might be some months where it just flat out feels like work because I'm having to work around publisher deadlines and release dates and trigger warnings and all kinds of things that make it hard sometimes to pick a shop subscription. And so if I could tell myself and I think I've gotten better about this during the pandemic, I think if I can just tell myself, Yeah, you're reading that for work. And maybe the next book you read should just be what Annie wants to read. And I think I've been way better about that this year. I've read and even last year, I read more. Y-Lit. I read more Kids lit like comfort lit revisiting books and I read this year I wanted to read Jane Austen. Nobody told me to read Jane Austen. That wasn't good for business. That was, you know, Jane Austen books sell themselves. That wasn't for The Bookshelf. That was strictly for Annie Jones, like something that I wanted to do. And I think that has been such a gift this year to just read something that was utterly for me. I think about the book and it wound up resonating with a lot of people. But I read this book called Millennial Nuns, not particularly the best written book I'd ever read. Think they needed an editor? But did I love spending time with those modern nuns? And then a couple of months later, serendipitously reading Matrix, like, it's like because I read Millennial Nuns, which I didn't think I was going to sell at The Bookshelf. I just thought that sounds good to me. And then I did wind up selling copies, but that was a perk that wasn't the plan. And so I do think I wonder if one benefit out of all this will be a more healthy expectation of what my reading life looks like and that some of it is work and some of it is still surprise and joy and fun. And it's OK if the work part doesn't always feel joyful, like that's OK.
Hunter McLendon [00:16:23] Yeah, no. Yeah, and it's it's so I don't know, as you were talking about that connection to, by the way, a of like Millennial Nuns and Matrix. I thought a lot about how because I sent you, I sent you a paragraph from Matrix. At one point I was like, Because, you know, we've talked about how Lauren Groff lists Middlemarch as her favorite book, and I think you can. You can tell that in any of her. But especially like, I think that Matrix really shows that. And I it's so funny because I was thinking I was like, Wow, I was like, I really would not have been able to fully appreciate what I know of Lauren Groff's, like I wouldn't have been able to make that connection as well if I hadn't read it. And so I just love being able to.
Annie Jones [00:17:03] Yes, and and I think, look, Middlemarch is something I 'had to read'. You and I had made this commitment not only to each other, but to Patreon supporters like you and I had made this goal. And so reading Middlemarch, make no mistake, felt like work, especially in certain sections, certain books. But did I get a whole lot of joy from talking to you? And then so much joy from reading authors like Lauren Groff or paying attention to the works of Greta Gerwig and seeing that book through their eyes and then following it up with My Life in Middlemarch by Rebecca Mead and absolutely being blown away by it. So like even though it started as this task I had to do for work once I remembered I have to do this for work, then it's like the benefits could be fun if I. But I had to like frame it, I had to reframe it and put it in its correct category in place.
Hunter McLendon [00:17:58] Well, yeah, that's it's so funny because I think a lot about how honestly, I think one of the biggest blessings in disguise that we have had for the past two years is that we decided the same here as a pandemic to like, like without knowing it. That's like have to start to start to conquer a classic. And really, the past two years, I think that one of I think you might agree with me that one of my biggest concepts of the thing that's kind of kept me somewhat structured is having these like check ins every month. Yes, you know, with these big books.
Annie Jones [00:18:29] Yes, absolutely. So has anything changed about your reading life? Like, I'm hearing a lot of customers say, Oh, my favorite genres have changed or I'm reading like I said, like, I'm reading more feel-good fiction than normal for me. Like, Has your reading life changed? Or do you feel kind of settling back into your typical genres? I'm just curious, did you notice any patterns to things that changed because of pandemic brain?
Hunter McLendon [00:19:01] Yeah, I noticed little. First of all, I just knew that like, nothing was really sticking with me. And that's like, I think that like for the first six months, nothing, really nothing stuck with me. Really like, I feel like it's almost like whenever I was thinking about, you know, because a while back, we did like a top 10 so far. Yes. And I think we both were like, was anything even sticking with us because, you know, just like, you know? But I think that like back in the at the end of August, I read intimacies like Katie Kitamura, and then Brandon Taylor, Filthy Animals Collection, Maggie Shipstead's Great Circle. And then I like and I kind of hit my stride with all those. And then I read Virtue by Hermione Hoby and I was. And that was like a more like it was kind of like it was. It was literary, but it was. It was such a fun age type. Yes, OK. And I. And it's like I read that and I was like, Oh, this is a book that I really typically like and I really enjoy. I was so surprised to be enjoying a book I normally like. Yes, and and I think that, you know, and I've read a couple of books since then that are more long, you know, like like I reread Matrix and I read the world a bit like you and I have just been kind of like smitten with with books I typically like again. And so for the first six months, I just I just was not like I was not liking anything at all really like I tried to read outside of my typical genre, too. But the past the past, like two ish months, I've gotten back into loving the books that I typically love.
Annie Jones [00:20:29] Do you think that, OK, think about early pandemic days, which we'll call 2020 and then later pandemic dates, which will call 2021? I feel like my reading life was worse for lack of a better term, harder. My reading life was harder to manage the first six months of this year than 2020.
Hunter McLendon [00:20:53] I think that in the beginning, I think that's the thing, right? I think in the beginning we were all stressed out because we're like, Oh no, there's a pandemic. And then we kind of like, we're getting set up because we were like, Well, OK, we have to go on. But then I think at some point we were like, OK, but like, I think it's going to get better. You know, and I think too like for like most of this year, it's just been like, we'll see. Like, I think that's the thing that we have not had, like no one at all. I don't I don't see how anyone has had the mental space for anything aside from that one question of will things ever get better?
Annie Jones [00:21:25] Yeah, I think you're right. I think we're spending a lot of mental energy on that one question. And early 2020, it's almost like not early 2020, early pandemic March to December 2020. I feel like I was running on adrenaline most of the time. And then weirdly, The Bookshelf was closing earlier, so I would come home at four p.m. I think this is actually legitimately true here in the South, our weather was better last year, like it didn't rain as much last summer, and I sat by my pool and read book after book after book and was surprised by, I think about the book, Most Likely by Sarah Watson. I think that book kind of came out of nowhere. It was this young adult book. I picked it up on a whim. Loved it. Like, I felt like I came across a lot of those in twenty twenty. And then it's like twenty twenty one hit and there was a wall. And the only I think the thing that I have been kind of surprised by and you do this better and more often than I do, but I have discovered audiobooks have helped me. Mm hmm. And being willing to both physically read a book and supplement it with audio format has helped me in a way that I don't know if that'll be how I am forever. But I have finished some books this year that I do not think I would have finished otherwise. But I was able to listen through libraries and do both, which is not something I really had tried until last year. You and I read Anna K and that's the first time I like, read and listened to a book just because of time constraints. And this year I've done the same thing with Jane Austen, but also with My Life in Middlemarch. With this was kind of a surprise, but with the book The Silent Patient, I had very little patience for that book reading it. But then I listened to it while I was cleaning my house one day and listened to the whole book. You know, which is which is I would not have been able to do that because I had too much to do. So that is one kind of change in my reading life that I do not think existed pre-pandemic. I would listen to an audiobook or read it. There was no combining of the two, but you did that a lot.
Hunter McLendon [00:23:34] Yeah, actually, it's so funny. It's another one of those things where I'm so glad that I discovered that I kind of was because I used to think I didn't like audiobooks, even though I don't know why, because I felt them. I didn't realize I've forgotten I had a history of audiobooks for it since my childhood, but I but I was. I listened to Busy Philipps memoir. This Will Only Hurt a Little. And I literally I like taking the day off and this is like, this is before the pandemic, but I've taken the day off and I thought, Oh, I'll clean and listen. I literally ended up crawling in my bed and spending eight hours listening to her reading this book to me. And I think that I'm so glad I. I fell in love with audiobooks because of her book, because it's it was a saving grace and it has been a saving grace throughout the pandemic because so many of the times I've been able to get out of my head, my own bad headspace has been by listening to books that I knew I wanted to read, but my my whole body was just like, No.
Annie Jones [00:24:26] Yes. Yeah, there is something about that. Like, I have been able to read more, I think because of supplementing my physical reading with audiobook reading. I also and this sounds counterintuitive, but I have given up on books more easily. So you talked about choosing, especially with books that you knew you would really like, like you chose to power through. There were some that I mean, I have a giant stack by my front door every month where I at the end of each month, it's almost like it feels like confession or like purging my sins like at the end of the month, I'm like, Oh, this is the stack of books that I am not going to get to, and I'm just going to admit that I'm not.
Hunter McLendon [00:25:07] That is also very funny because I feel like we flip flop because I used to give a fun book super easy, and you used to be the person who stayed committed.
Annie Jones [00:25:15] Yes, we have. Because you, I think you should tell me, OK, it's not if I'm not in it by 50 pages. And now that's honestly my rule. Like, I have given up on books this year that I should have liked, but I just thought, Now wait a minute, I don't have time, and I don't think I think pre-pandemic I had the wherewithal to power through and to stick to something. I don't have that energy anymore. I think one day I'll get it back, but I do not have it now, and so I have been much more. Ready to give up on a book if needed. I also did you write this note in here? Did you write any notes and here are these all mine?
Hunter McLendon [00:25:54] I think all these are yours.
Annie Jones [00:25:55] OK? I think it's funny. I wrote down. Forget books more easily. Mm-Hmm. I think I am going to finish this year, and it's like you said we came up with like our top ten at the midpoint of the year, and there are a handful of books that will stick with me by December 31st, 2021. I'm not sure what they will be. I have my suspicions, I have my guesses, but I think I will enter 2022 and be like what I read last year. I have no idea.
Hunter McLendon [00:26:22] Like, well, and that's the thing too. By the way, I like, listen, I have got like, I mean, and this is, yes, this is a brag. I have a stellar memory like you do, like like, yeah. And it's like, I'm like, Try me, you know, to anyone. And so it is so surprising to me to go from having, I mean, I can literally quote anything about anything I get, like, I'm constantly referencing like like movies and books. And I can tell you, like every finalist for every National Book Award. And yet I forgot that I had like the other day, I was looking through books and I said, Oh, I was like, I should read this one. I think it came out this year and I had read it, gave it a glowing review. I could not, could not even record as out.
Annie Jones [00:27:05] Yeah, I think I will have a lot of books this year, and it doesn't mean they're bad books because I think that says a lot more about us than it does about the content. I think it's just says a lot about our current mental state. But I think I will end this year and have a lot of trouble remembering and I don't have the memory you do like. I frequently will say I remember how books made me feel. I do not remember character names, et cetera. But I think there will be books that I just completely block from memory accidentally. Yeah, because I honestly think they're two weeks from this year that I'm going to be like, I don't need to remember that.
Hunter McLendon [00:27:39] That's what happened. That's another thing, too. You know, like, you know, it's we forget sometimes how how much books and music and movies and even the foods we eat during a really trying time like make it really difficult. Like if you're going to exercise like these, like horrific moments from your mind in your life, like you have to also kind of like jettison everything else that's related to it.
Annie Jones [00:28:04] Mm hmm. What are the books that you think you will remember as the books that helped you make it through the pandemic that helped restore your love of reading? Like, I'm thinking of these as wins, like these are the books that despite my my current incapacitated state like like these are still the books that were able to make a mark for sure.
Hunter McLendon [00:28:32] For sure Milk Blood Heat by Dantiel W. Moniz. But her short story collection, I read it like at the very tail end of last year, but it was the 20 21 release and I have reread the collection several times since and there was just something. It is. It is, truly. A book that felt written for me as a reader, and so that kind of gave me like a false, like a false sense of hope for like my reading here and then a Great Circle by Maggie Shipstead is one that I am so glad I read, just because it has been so hard for me to commit to longer books. And that's like a 600 page book that I ended up loving. I am trying to think like I. I mean, obviously, The Matrix is a obvious oh, a backlist book that restored my faith in humanity was actually. Well, actually, I will say two of them. I read Home and Lila. Yes. Which you read? Did you reject yet?
Annie Jones [00:29:33] I have not read Jack yet.
Hunter McLendon [00:29:34] OK, but she read the other two.
Annie Jones [00:29:35] Yes. Yes. I read. Did I read Lila? I know I read home, and this is the year I reread Juliet. Like I, I reread it. I had forgotten all about that, too. You just said it. I reread that this year because I I went to the beach with my parents. They were basically made me go like, look like, Do you ever just think the people in your life are kind of like, you need some help? Yes. And it was April, I'm pretty sure, April of this year, and I went with them for a weekend and I only packed books I knew I would like restore me to myself. Like I took Gilead. I took. A collection of Flannery O'Connor short stories, which I hadn't touched since college and just felt so at peace in reading these books that reminded me of my former selves too. There is something so profoundly comforting about that, and I am not, you know, I'm not a huge reader at all. But there was something about it that I found. Yeah, I guess comforting is the right word.
Hunter McLendon [00:30:42] It's so funny because when I when I read at home this year, which I it's like I had tried to read home many times before and could not connect with it. But somehow I ended up connecting with it this year of all years. And when I finished and that's it, like in you and I have talked about how we want to talk about it, maybe at some point, like books that just like perfect endings to books. But I truly think that home has such a perfect ending. Yeah. And she talks about crying at the end of Gilead. But like, I was like, I was first of all, I should not be reading at work, but I do. And then I was reading, I read home. I finished it at work and I was literally like crying and like, I was like, and I was like, I was like standing outside of people's offices, like hollering through my mask. And I was like, I'm very moved.
Annie Jones [00:31:33] That's how I felt about finishing Megha Majumbar's A Burning. That was a book that I read last year. I have, and this is what I mean. I cannot always remember character names, but I will never forget. We were back open at the store, but like, things were still weird and I got to the store before anybody else. And so the store was not open yet. The doors were locked. It was dark and quiet and I was like, I have a lot of work to do, but I'm going to finish this book first. And I literally sat in the downstairs floor The Bookshelf and I wept. But I also just was kind of stunned, like I finished it and I was like, I don't know what to do now. I don't know what to do with myself now. And there is something. It's like, it's like I needed to be moved, but didn't know how to get those feelings out. It wasn't even like I had knowingly suppressed those feelings, right? It's just like through adrenaline or just sheer force of will or need. Like, I knew I need to run my business. I need to get through this pandemic. Like I didn't know that I also needed to grieve or to feel. And books really did help me do that when I think about books that I read in the last 12 to 18 months. Interestingly, lots of grief books come to mind and grief memoirs. I think about Crying in H Mart by Michelle Zauner. And that is a book like you with Lauren Groff. I started Crying in H Mart. Loved the first chapter, which is the essay the book is kind of based around and on loved it then kept reading. I was like, This is good, but I put it down. I picked it back up three months later, devoured it, loved it, picked it as a Shelf subscription title. So it's just it's just funny to me how books also. It's not wrong for the effect of a book to be impacted by your mood or state of mind. Like, that's OK, that's called humanity. Well, like I. But it was it was shocking to me how deeply moved I was by that book, especially after starting it and really liking it, but not not thinking or knowing if I would have the power to finish and then picking it back up and being so deeply moved. These books about grief when we all to some extent were experiencing collective grief, but without our traditional mechanisms of grieving, I have found a lot of those books. The Death of Vivek Oji is another one that comes quite like these books that I just felt like. Almost like, you know, when Cher, like, slapped in Moonstruck, she like, slaps him in the face and she's like, Snap out of it. Like, I almost feel like books needed to do that to me, like Annie, feel something. Any wake up like it's you have things that you need to think and feel. And so those those come to mind or books that left me unsettled, like Rumaan Alam's book Leave the World Behind, like like there are just books, right? Like that you just I felt like I would never feel anything again or like books would not have the power to move me ever again. And then they did.
Hunter McLendon [00:34:50] It's so funny that, like speaking, I know that nobody wants to, like, read a book that that encapsulates the feeling of 2020. But I feel like Leave the world behind was truly that book. And but it's what I needed. It is like I needed to know that other people were feeling exactly that.
Annie Jones [00:35:08] You know, it's like that claustrophobic kind of terror filled my my story about finishing that book, which I feel like I have told all this podcast a couple of times. But Jordan and I had, like gone to Savannah to try to safely air quotes vacation in any way that we could last late last summer, like August of last year. And I read Leave the World Behind, and I looked at Jordan and I was like, Please drive me out into the world so I can just see a person like I. It was so deeply unsettling, but I think I needed to feel that way. I think I needed I needed that. And I know there are some readers for whom that sounds horrible. Yeah, but I think I did really need that kind of slap in the face book moment.
Hunter McLendon [00:35:52] I actually put that as my number one pick for like I like I was. I ranked I did a personal ranking of the National Book Award long list for 2020. A couple of days ago, and I put Leave the world behind as my number one pick because I thought, like that book truly encapsulates everything, and so many people messaged me and they were like, That book made me so like, they were so upset by it. They were like, I cannot. And so, you know, it's I don't know. Listen, I'm the kind of person where, like, if I'm wounded, I'm going to take out the bullet, you know, like, I'm like, I'm not going to.
Annie Jones [00:36:23] Yes, yes. And you want a book like, I could understand how that book could make your top list because a book isn't just about how it made you feel, although that is a huge part. It's also about the book that speaks to the moment and there. That, to me, was a book that encapsulated a lot of the feelings and a lot of the moments we were living through in twenty twenty. And I don't know how he did it because he wrote that book, but wait for 2020, so I don't know how that's possible. But but to me, my favorite books of the year are the ones that, yes, make me feel something, but also speak to the current history we're living. The Transcendent Kingdom, I think did that a little bit to me last year as well. So they're like literary fiction. I didn't completely ditch like there were still things that I really liked, but I guess I found myself realizing it was OK to supplement my favorite genre literary fiction with a middle grade favorite or the Babysitter's Club, or most likely, like I or Millennial Nuns like it taught me that it was OK to keep reading literary fiction, but I it was OK if I didn't have a steady diet of it. Yeah.
Hunter McLendon [00:37:45] Also side note. I don't know if I ever told you this, that's just a little funny side thing, I read both Transcendent Kingdom and Luster by Raven Leilani, oh gosh, I can't remember her name, but I read both at work, and Luster was like a really big she was a five hundred thirty five. Last year it was like a big deal in the book. And she anyway, I read both of those while I had COVID and I read Luster not knowing I had COVID. And I let me tell you so they reading a book when you don't even realize that you have like I, I was. So I was like, I was like, Why Raven Leilani? Yeah, I was so confused by it. And I and I literally thought, I thought it was the book being like, Messed me up. And then all of a sudden, like, I get a call after I had because I had gotten tested to see it and they were like, Oh, you! And I was like, Oh, thank goodness I started this. I was writing the book. And so every time someone asks me, How is that? I always tell people that, Oh yeah, it's a mind trip. And then they read it and they're like, what? No, it's not like,
Annie Jones [00:38:57] I want to know if you're OK saying, I want to know, do you think COVID has had a long term impact on your attention span?
Hunter McLendon [00:39:05] Oh yes, I listen. I can not do it. Like, I am convinced. Like, dude, I don't know why anyone would want this. Like, it was miserable. I still like every first of all, I have really bad chest pain still. And I know that's partly because I have a lot of energy drinks, but I'm also going to blame it on COVID.
Annie Jones [00:39:21] And you got it early because it was scary when you got it. Like, I remember being scared for you because we still didn't know very much. I mean, it's still scary, but like, we didn't know a lot about it. And I do think there is a long term. I think I have not had COVID. I think I too have a changed attention span and a changed capacity. But I think for people who have had COVID and for whom reading is typically a comfort and a joy. Yeah, I guess if you're listening to this and you had COVID and you feel like you'll never be the same, I I would like to encourage you. I think you will be the same, but be kind to yourself because your attention span probably really has changed.
Hunter McLendon [00:40:02] Yeah. Like, it's so funny because I after I had it, it was. It was about two and a half three weeks where I realized that everything I was reading, I it was it literally felt like I was just flooding right back out of my brain. And...
Annie Jones [00:40:14] That you weren't retaining anything?
Hunter McLendon [00:40:16] Yes. And that was really tough. And it has continued. And even now, it's so funny because the days because so spoil. Sorry to anyone who's going to be disappointed in me. But the first day I was sick, I was so like, You're I'm telling you when you're me, you have it. You don't realize that your brain is so messed up, you don't even realize what you're doing. And so I had gone into thankfully, like nobody else is in the office, but I'd gone into work and I sat at my desk for three and a half hours, and all of a sudden I looked up and realized my computer wasn't even on yet. Oh my gosh. And I was like, Oh, and I said, I text my boss and said, I think I need to go home. And I had been like, Mate, they wanted me to go into work even though I like so I. And then finally, I kept saying, Oh, I don't think I can come in. I still am not feeling well. And so like, you know, so yeah. And then and then my brain just didn't work for a while. And but anyway, but my feeling, my point was, let's say was, is that that thing of like steering Syria, looking at your computer after three and a half hours and realizing it's not on, I still have those moments. And I don't think that I think those are going to stay for a while. But but I have had less and less of them as the year has gone on. And so like...
Annie Jones [00:41:26] And there's no shame, I think we talked briefly about your reading speed and your reading capacity. And I told Jordan last night, like, I've read way more books than I thought I would have read this year, but I'll use it just on my brain because you and I are about to record another episode. But my life in Middlemarch is on my brain because that's what I've read most recently. And there were multiple times in reading that book that I had to stop reread the paragraph I had just read, or I had to pause the audiobook, go find my physical copy. And I guess I that's the other bit of encouragement I would say is like, it's OK if your brain isn't functioning the way you're used to it functioning, like if you're not retaining information, the way you're used to retaining it, or if you're if things aren't quite holding your attention the way they once were. I just think that that's OK, and there's nothing wrong with rereading a paragraph multiple times or, you know, listening to an audiobook and rewinding 15 seconds. Like, there's just nothing wrong with kind of using these tactics and tools to make up for all that our brains are doing, because I think that's the thing, right? You put that, I think you said it perfectly. Our brains are busy trying to answer this question of when is this going to get better? And so to read a book is superfluous, like, like to read a book. Your brain may just be really busy trying to solve other problems. And so be kind to your brain.
Hunter McLendon [00:42:50] Well, and also, it's so funny. I want to say I would love to know if people who have had have had to deal with a significant trauma are maybe coping a little bit better with this than people who maybe have that because I feel like, I mean not to like, you know, but I think a lot about like what things I had gone through. I was younger and how some of this is actually I'm like, Oh, I'm like, It's fine, like, I can actually like, do pretty well with this versus like, there's the people I know who have had like, like, it's not like it. It's not like a comparison thing. But it is just interesting to see some people who I know haven't really been through as much and they're really struggling. And it makes me think of this movie with Kirtsen Dunst and it's called Melancholia, I believe. And yeah. And in that movie, it's like it's about to be the end of the world. And Kristen Dunst you know, she's like, she's super depressed, but she is totally fine. She's like, OK, like, let's get this together and everyone else is normal is in a panic. And I think, though.
Annie Jones [00:43:52] I think there's something to that.
Hunter McLendon [00:43:54] Yeah. And so I think it's I think that something like that's worth I would I would really be interested in some people exploring that even with their own selves. Just yeah, you know.
Hunter McLendon [00:44:04] You know, in in book therapy and literary therapy. Hunter, this has been a delight. I knew I wanted to have this conversation and I wanted to record it. I feel like you and I could have had this conversation on our own, but I really, I guess I just wanted I'm hearing so much from customers in store, whether it's Mary Katherine has commented that a lot of people are coming in and like almost with a with a look of panic in their face, saying, Do you have a feel good book like, can I just have something light and fun? And then I know that Kyla and Olivia have fallen in love with T.J. Clune because of the way his books have made them feel like I think people are. However, the pandemic is affecting them because I think it's different for different people. There is still this collective response of. The capacity has changed, the tastes may have changed, and so I guess I just wanted to record an episode that made people know you're not alone. It is OK. You could be. You could be like me where you're you're reading. Life has changed a little bit. Your favorite genres aren't maybe what they used to be. But there is hope, like there are books out there for you and maybe you're reading life will also ultimately improve because you'll put. I just think I'm setting boundaries on my reading life in a way that might actually help me long term. Whereas if I were to be going at the same rate of, like 2019, I'm not sure. I'm not sure where I'd be. So anyway, I just I'm grateful to you for having this conversation with me.
Hunter McLendon [00:45:34] I'm grateful to you always for everything.
Annie Jones [00:45:39] From the Front Porch is a weekly podcast production of The Bookshelf, an independent bookstore in South Georgia. You can follow The Bookshelf’s daily happenings on Instagram at @bookshelftville, and all the books from today’s episode can be purchased online through our store website, www.bookshelfthomasville.com.
A full transcript of today’s episode can be found at www.fromthefrontporchpodcast.com.
Special thanks to Dylan and his team at Studio D Production for sound and editing and for our theme music, which sets the perfect warm and friendly tone for our Thursday conversations.
This week, what I'm reading is brought to you by Visit Thomasville. I began working in Thomasville the summer of 2013, but it took me a long time to acclimate, to begin to think of Thomasville as home. And Thomas will host lots of small town events, like things that make you feel like you're living the Stars Hollow Hallmark Movie Life. But it wasn't until October of 2013 that I had my moment. This moment where I realized I could do this, I could stay here. So every October on the Thursday or Friday closest to Halloween, all of the students from our local downtown preschools and there are several dress up for Halloween, and they parade down Broad Street, which is where The Bookshelf is.
Business owners sit outside of their businesses and pass out candy, and it was on a I just have this very vivid memory. It was on a still slightly humid October morning, sitting in front of The Bookshelf greeting these kids that I read to in story time. Seeing them dress as farm animals and movie superheroes and realizing, Oh, I love where I live. I love what Thomasville has to offer. It was really this magical moment for me. So to find out how you can visit Thomasville or dare I say it called Thomasville Home? Go to:
www.thomasvillega.com
Annie Jones This week, I’m reading Groundskeeping by Lee Cole. Hunter, What are you reading?
Hunter McLendon [00:47:35] I'm reading The Souvenir Museum by Elizabeth McCracken.
Annie Jones [00:47:39] Thank you again to our sponsor. Visit Thomasville. Whether you live close by or are passing through, I really do believe you would enjoy a visit to beautiful Thomasville, Georgia. If you liked what you heard on today’s episode, tell us by leaving a review on iTunes. Or, if you’re so inclined, support us for $5 a month on Patreon, where you can follow along as Hunter and I conquer a classic and participate in live video Q&As in our monthly lunch break sessions. Just go to patreon.com/fromthefrontporch.
We’re so grateful for you, and we look forward to meeting back here next week.